[Bevo]

A few facts for the future. PER HONDA

Power management in gears 1-3 has been reduced per factory spec
Power management in gears 1-3 is further reduced under 3,000 rpm
Power management in Sport mode is not 100% available engine power

Any shop running this bike on a dyno in ANY of the rider modes will not be a true reflection of base ECM power. HSTC must be turned off for best available power. The bike must be stopped, you must be in user mode, you must press and hold the torque control switch. Only when the trac light shows on the dash with the line through it are you complete.

Note: Even with HSTC full disabled, the ECM will reduce power in gears 1-3 at certain RPMs. Only a true ECU flash will remove the factory power limits in gears 1-3.

Even though the owners manual says to stop the bike, in user mode I can use the Torque switch to turn off torque control on the fly.

 

[BigOne-94-14]

A few facts for the future. PER HONDA

Power management in gears 1-3 has been reduced per factory spec
Power management in gears 1-3 is further reduced under 3,000 rpm
Power management in Sport mode is not 100% available engine power

Any shop running this bike on a dyno in ANY of the rider modes will not be a true reflection of base ECM power. HSTC must be turned off for best available power. The bike must be stopped, you must be in user mode, you must press and hold the torque control switch. Only when the trac light shows on the dash with the line through it are you complete.

Note: Even with HSTC full disabled, the ECM will reduce power in gears 1-3 at certain RPMs. Only a true ECU flash will remove the factory power limits in gears 1-3.

What you quoted doesn't make much sense. Is the following what we should understand?

1. Power in gears 1-3 has been reduced per factory spec
2. Power in gears 1-3 is further reduced under 3,000 rpm
3. Power in Sport mode is not 100% available engine power

Also, is this specific to the USA model? Power seems very muted below 5,000rpm, and so bullets 1 and 2 would make sense.

 

[Bevo]

Also, is this specific to the USA model? Power seems very muted below 5,000rpm, and so bullets 1 and 2 would make sense.

I know the throttle bodies on US spec SC77 models were only opening 73% at full throttle, so once Woolich Racing cracked the ECU I had mine flashed to UK spec. Totally different bike now. I have no idea if the same is true for the US spec SC80

 

[CB Austin Guy]

What you quoted doesn't make much sense. Is the following what we should understand?

1. Power in gears 1-3 has been reduced per factory spec
2. Power in gears 1-3 is further reduced under 3,000 rpm
3. Power in Sport mode is not 100% available engine power

Also, is this specific to the USA model? Power seems very muted below 5,000rpm, and so bullets 1 and 2 would make sense.

Hey BigOne, thanks. Yes that is correct. As for the US vs Euro models, I can't confirm but it seems a stretch that Honda would tailor power like that per region with being an emissions requirement, and doubly not to disclose they were doing so to the public.

As for lack of power down low, that is true. There really isn't much Honda can do to rework the power curve of the Early Fireblades to get a ton more low end power that wont affect the top end or emissions. In the end its a toss up, do you want to feel fast(torq) or do you want to be fast(hp)?

 

[Bevo]

As for the US vs Euro models, I can't confirm but it seems a stretch that Honda would tailor power like that per region with being an emissions requirement, and doubly not to disclose they were doing so to the public.

On the US SC77 and SC82 models, Honda reduced power compared to Euro/UK spec bikes in order to meet EPA noise restrictions. They even rubber cemented these blockoff plates in the intake tubes of the US spec SC77.

They're not found in Euro/UK models.

 

[CB Austin Guy]

On the US SC77 and SC82 models, Honda reduced power compared to Euro/UK spec bikes in order to meet EPA noise restrictions. They even rubber cemented these blockoff plates in the intake tubes of the US spec SC77.

View attachment 48856

They're not found in Euro/UK models.

That's pretty interesting, I think there are a few bikes in Texas that could do with that. I swear I can hear some bikes in Austin from half way across the city.

Also saw your post on disabling torque control on the fly. That's pretty cool, I would go out to my bike and try it out, but my 2019 got stolen last week. Utterly depressed.

 

[Bevo]

That's pretty cool, I would go out to my bike and try it out, but my 2019 got stolen last week. Utterly depressed.

Damn that sucks. FYI, Honda is offering a $2000 Factory-to-Dealer Incentive. Offer is valid with the purchase of new and unregistered 2019 CB1000R ABS models (CB1000RAK). Offer valid through 12/31/2020.

Obviously I don't know where your bike was stolen, but apartment complexes and parking garages are shopping malls for bike thieves.

 

[BigOne-94-14]

"As for lack of power down low, that is true. There really isn't much Honda can do to rework the power curve of the Early Fireblades to get a ton more low end power that wont affect the top end or emissions"


The engine in every other guise has a ton more low end power. This bike has been sorely hobbled in the 2018-on CB1000R.

 

[CB Austin Guy]

"As for lack of power down low, that is true. There really isn't much Honda can do to rework the power curve of the Early Fireblades to get a ton more low end power that wont affect the top end or emissions"


The engine in every other guise has a ton more low end power. This bike has been sorely hobbled in the 2018-on CB1000R.

Please reread my post. I specifically said, "early fireblade". So if you know of any 2006-2007 Fireblade powered bikes that have "a ton more low end power" that can match the top that can also pass EURO 4, plz do tell.

The bike is "sorely hobbled"? Sure. It's a hobbled bike that runs a quarter mile half a second faster than the previous CB1000R.

 

[CB Austin Guy]

RapidBike just got back to me with a few Dyno Graphs performed on a completely stock standard CB1000R 2018, without the Akrapovič exhaust and map.


Gilles from RapidBike Australia explains that the TPS7-18_Map represents a small, partial throttle opening, typical of a normal riding style. The TPS95_Map refers to the wide open throttle map.



TPS7-18_Map

View attachment 46954

TPS95_Map

View attachment 46956

This post is great, thanks so much! I read this last year and then re-read again and now I can't stop looking at it.

It appears fuel is limited to 14.7 for the first 7-8,000 RPM and from then on the AF ratio seems to be allowed to move to ~13 or so.

I am no expert and I surely don't know what Honda has done to the ECU map on the bike in order to comply with EURO4, but from what I understand most bikes are restricted until a given RPM and also by throttle position(ex fuel is restricted until 80% throttle). My guess is that many ECU's on bikes remove some restrictions under wide open throttle, and if that that is true then the true impact of remaps may not be completely shown on many dyno charts since they are almost always done at WOT.

I am interested in the chart as it shows ECU map impact to the power at partial throttle. If the dyno chart is accurate that means at this throttle position and RPM ~6,100 the CB1000r power is 19.5HP stock vs 25.5 with the re-map. That would be a 31% boost in power at that specific RPM and throttle position.

Other questions comes up, what is the throttle position for this dyno and at what point does the ECU lift restrictions?

 

[Bevo]

My guess is that many ECU's on bikes remove some restrictions under wide open throttle, and if that that is true then the true impact of remaps may not be completely shown on many dyno charts since they are almost always done at WOT.

I can't speak to US spec SC80 models, but US spec SC77 model OEM maps were only allowing the throttle bodies to open at 73% at full throttle while UK spec bikes were at 100%.

 

[BigOne-94-14]

Please reread my post. I specifically said, "early fireblade". So if you know of any 2006-2007 Fireblade powered bikes that have "a ton more low end power" that can match the top that can also pass EURO 4, plz do tell.

The bike is "sorely hobbled"? Sure. It's a hobbled bike that runs a quarter mile half a second faster than the previous CB1000R.

I can read. I know what you said and what my answer was.

 

[par112]

I can't speak to US spec SC80 models, but US spec SC77 model OEM maps were only allowing the throttle bodies to open at 73% at full throttle while UK spec bikes were at 100%.

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